Forums at Society of the Military Horse

That may well be true. Then on the other hand, using the same reasoning, the thick ones were used on the M1902 Bridles "Officer Pattern"...why haven't we seen any thick ones with the centered loops? They were in use before the M1909's were produced. This could be another case of specificat...

Yes, I knew the thin rosettes were the earlier ones found on the M1902 bridle and the early M1909's. Joe is correct in that the early descriptions have the thin rosettes on the enlisted men's bridles and the thicker rosettes are to be used on the officers' equipments (See the Description of Horse Eq...

Folks, I recently purchased a M1909 bridle with the early thin style eagle rosettes thinking it is an early production bridle of that model. I noticed that one of the rosettes was built with the retaining loop on back attached not on the center line of the rosette but off center to allow for there t...

Gordon, I have read (and can no longer quote the source) that the semi automatic pistol was of such great concern to the military because there WAS a great number of incidents in which a trooper did, indeed, shoot his horse accidentally. It seems that the involuntary reaction of an individual to cle...

Joe,
Remember, there are two types of JQMD tags - - "Manufactured by JQMD," and "REPAIRED by JQMD." We can't just say JQMD marked. It can mean two completely different things.
Rick T.

Pat,
Take a look at the quarterstraps and girth ring keepers on this photo. I'm not so sure this saddle isn't Godfrey rigged. Any info on the date of this photo? If it is in the '30's, I would think that late for even Nat'l Guard Cav to have 1st pattern '04's.
Rick T.
Intersting shot.

Merry Christmas everyone. I was executing my daily perusal of the Military Horse site and it struck me that these were very festive days in the life of the old "horse" posts, whatever era. From what I can gleen, the day was a rather light one, spent mainly cleaning, getting ready for those...

Interestingly, Randy Steffen may have done our work for us. On page 44, of Volume IV, of his "The Horse Soldier, 1776-1943," he states that in December, 1922, the Cavalry Board recommended that the Dela Los-model French saddle, manufactured by H. Marquis, be used for the pattern for manufa...

As Ron notes, we do know that the government had purchased trees. Is this what Marquis is laying claim to as being a contractor to the government? We still haven't seen any Marquis production saddles with U.S. inspection marks as would have been required under the normal contract process (for just a...

Now that's interesting! Just what did the government contract to them for? OK, who wants to go to the National Archives?
Rick T.

Joe, I quite agree. I just didn't want another "collectorism" to develop, especially from this site. I feel that we should strive to be able to back up what we say with either veteran testimony, photographic evidence, or official documentation before we accept something as fact on this sit...

I agree on the point that there is more to this than we now know. A repair tag means just that, though, it was repaired at JQMD or RIA. If it were manufactured there, it would have a "Manufactured By.." tag. I don't know of any bayonet fitted saddles that have a "manufactured by"...

And again...the letter said only the TREES were being purchased from Europe. The leatherwork was done right here at the arsenal. I share Todd's opinion that the finest saddlework was found right here at Rock Island Arsenal (and later at JQMD). There were lots of officer quality items that were offer...

Ron, I'd still like to see actual reference cites before I accept that French made saddles were contracted by the army. Too many "collectorisms" have been accepted as fact which we later find were not so. What you read may indeed be right, I'd just like to see the research before I accept ...

Gents, What is the source material that references the M1917's being made in France under U.S. contract? I have never seen such documentation and of course am very curious about it. To the best of my knowledge, the French made M1917's (and polo saddles along with other training saddles and associate...

Ron, To add to what Todd has told you, many American officers purchased the French made equipments both while serving in France during the war and afterwards. I have seen two of the French made saddles that bore American arsenal repair tags, even though the pieces themselves were not arsenal made. T...

Bob, I read Hoig's book on Ft. Reno. Much information I wasn't aware of especially the cattle lands leasing/public lands era. A very overlooked time the military was involved in (kind of like referees!). Do you know Mr. Hoig? Some of his information on weapons put down in the Ft. Reno book was incor...

Thanks for posting this, Bob. I for one, will be looking for this book. Being originally from the area and fortunate enough to have tramped around the subject sites, it is one my more favorite subject areas. Not enough is done about Ft. Reno and the Darlington Agency. There is much history in those ...

Joe, On page 188 of Volume 3, he speaks of "one of the most noticeable changes in horse equipments that resulted from the 1902 uniform change was the switch from black to russet, or fair, leather for all horse equipments, and all leather uniform items..." My point was that it was finally p...

Pat, Most people attribute the changeover from black to russet as being 1902. I think this is another "Steffanism," though. There is arsenal correspondence dated "1900" that speaks of the new russet equipments. So, I am convinced that the changeover happened at least that early. ...