The M1883 to M1904 Campaign Hats

Todd · Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:54 am

Not entirely sure that 'coney' is relating to rabbit, though it might in this case. Coneys are one of the names for 'guinea pigs' - and having had members of that animal species in the house for several years now, I can attest that they could also bear the name of 'living bags of hair'.

Todd

Pat Holscher · Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:11 pm

Originally posted by Todd
Not entirely sure that 'coney' is relating to rabbit, though it might in this case. Coneys are one of the names for 'guinea pigs' - and having had members of that animal species in the house for several years now, I can attest that they could also bear the name of 'living bags of hair'.

Todd

Yikes. I'd hate to think of the Army being issued guinea pig hats.

Pat

rayg · Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:51 am

If I remember reading, Corney is what is called hats made from a small mammal in Australia. Can't recall the name of it but I believe it's larger then a gunia pig. Ray

RayG/Wisconsin

Trooper · Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:39 am

"Coney may be:"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coney
take your pick!
In connection with the 1872 campaign hat I don't think it means
"Caribbean fish" - most likely rabbit - but I prefer the Guinea animal reference as it is one ugly pig of a hat![:D]

Dušan

Todd · Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:46 am

Oops - gotta put that pipe down... was thinking 'coney' and should have been thinking 'cavies'. However, they're still bags of hair with eyes.

Todd

rayg · Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:02 pm

Oops I see Corney does mean rabbits hair. However I know I read some where that they used another animal's hair in Australia. Wish I could remenber where I read it. Ray

RayG/Wisconsin

Trooper · Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:31 pm

Maybe kangaroo in Oz - Sam might know?

Dušan

Pat Holscher · Wed Dec 20, 2006 9:25 pm

Originally posted by rayg
Oops I see Corney does mean rabbits hair. However I know I read some where that they used another animal's hair in Australia. Wish I could remember where I read it. Ray

RayG/Wisconsin

Rats, just as I was about to pose a theory that Custer lost at LBH because the 7th was wearing guinea pig fur hats.

Actually, I found a source on the net that claims coney as a word for a type of rabbit fur, used for felt, in France. I'd find the French connection odd here, however, as I can't imagine that fur was imported.

Pat

Couvi · Thu Dec 21, 2006 6:37 am

Weren’t the 1872 and 1885 helmets also made of coney?

Couvi

<i>"Cavalier sans Cheval"</i>

dallas Φ · Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:52 am

On Page 38 of BRASS SPIKES AND HORSETAIL PLUMES, A HISTORY OF U.S. ARMY DRESS HELMETS, 1872-1904 by Gordon Chappell, the following is noted: "The contract-procured enlisted helmet shells always were made of felt, a type of cloth which is not spun or woven, but is made of matted fibers of wool or fur or hair, or a mixture of such components, combined with 'sizing' of some sort of glue or shellac or varnish, then rolled and pressed." "Into the making of felt would go materials such as 'coney,' the fur of a European rabbit or rodent, or of a similar American animal; 'nutria,' the plucked fur or pelt of a South American aquatic rodent called the coypu; 'beaver' or 'muskrat' fur from animals of the same names; and other similar materials. The particular components of the felt from which American helmets were manufactured varied from one specification to the next. For example, in contrast to those already quoted, specifications adopted February 12, 1889, were noticeably different:

"Material: To be made of felt composed of two-fifths (2/5) yellow carroted double ring I H Russia, two-fifths (2/5) yellow carroted best coney backs, and one-fifth (1/5) best colored muskrat."

I have no idea what yellow carroted I H Russia means.
Dallas

Pat Holscher · Thu Dec 21, 2006 8:46 pm

Are Australian slouch hats and NZ Lemon squeezers rabbit fur?

Pat

Pat Holscher · Sat Jan 06, 2007 10:51 pm

Is TR's hat here one of the regulation hats?

Pat

Trooper · Sun Jan 07, 2007 10:35 am

Certainly appears to have some stitching on the brim, but I don't know what the darker are above the sabes insignia is. It doesn't look like a regulation ventilator. It may be a Brooks Bros version?

Dušan

Trooper · Thu Jan 18, 2007 11:21 am

http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-General-Fun ... dZViewItem

Scroll down for hat details.

Dušan

Trooper · Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:47 am

The alternative campaign hat - good pictures:
http://cgi.ebay.com/1880-Pattern-US-Arm ... dZViewItem

Dušan

Trooper · Fri Mar 23, 2007 9:35 am

1902 campaign hat:
http://cgi.ebay.com/U-S-A-Spanish-Ameri ... dZViewItem

Dušan

dallas Φ · Fri Mar 23, 2007 7:21 pm

It will be interesting to see what that hat sells for. I sold an unissued M1902 hat several years ago for $250.
Dallas

Pat Holscher · Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:28 pm

Originally posted by dallas
It will be interesting to see what that hat sells for. I sold an unissued M1902 hat several years ago for $250.
Dallas

Wow. How did you ever find an unissued one?

Pat

rayg · Tue Mar 27, 2007 8:53 am

That hat on ebay is one of the nicest 1902 hats I've ever seen. Well contract and depot marked and no apparent insect damage. Ray

RayG/Wisconsin

dallas Φ · Tue Mar 27, 2007 2:56 pm

I note that at 1600 CDT on 3/27, there are still no bids.

Pat: That unissued hat that I had, I bought back in the 1960s for next to nothing. I don't remember where it came from, but it was a nice hat.
Dallas