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Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

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Postby Pat Holscher » Mon Dec 19, 2011 7:51 pm

Pat Holscher wrote:Photos and text courtesy of Gary Snelling:

Image
Text by Gary Snelling
Doesn't it look so easy to load these creatures? If one didn't want to go in? Fun was had by all!!!


Image
Text by Gary Snelling
Regrouping outside Victoria Falls on the Bulawayo road. Off to a new operational area.


Image
Text by Gary Snelling
Trooper Keith Robb giving a poor salute!!


Good example of soldier humor in that last one.

These are some really interesting examples of horse transportation. I may also post these to the horse transportation thread.


Pat


I'm going to refer to this in a new post, so I thought I'd bump this up.
Pat

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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:23 pm

D. COST: Horses can conduct operations at the lower-end of the
spectrum of conflict effectively and economically. In terms of end
item costs alone, it is possible, purchasing local horses in most
countries, to mount a platoon for the cost of a 2 1/2 ton truck
(1:24). The savings in comparison to other mobility equipment
(armored personnel carriers and utility helicopters) increases in
geometric proportions. The savings extend further to accessory anu
spare parts as well as fuel (food and forage). The Portuguese and
Rhodc. ian experience from 1961 - 1980 clearly demonstrated that all
horse furniture (saddlery, bridling, etc.) could be fabricated
locally (2:20). Regarding food, even if provender had to be
imported, it remains cheaper in bulk quantities than the petroleum,
6
oil and lubricants that would be required for transportation
equipment.
E. LOGISTICAL SUPPORTABILITY: In comparison to mechanical
equipment, the logistical requirements to operate, maintain and
sustain horses are insignificant. Essentially horses require
saddlery, bridling and, in some cases, horse shoes. The Portuguese
in Angola and the Rhodesians were able to fabricate these items
locally (2:20). Wherever there is an indigenous horse population,
food and forage is also available locally. There are some
operational areas where food and forage would have to be supplied
externally. Generally, the only items that would have to be
provided to a host country would be medicine and equipment required
9 to conduct veterinary support.


From: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=11349&p=101304#p101304
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:38 pm

From the same article that Sam located and posted:

F. RHODESIA 1976-1980
Although the two main liberation movements in Rhodesia, the
Zimbabwe African People's Union (ZAPU) and the Zimbabwe African
National Union (ZANU) were formed in the early 1960's, insurgency
warfare did not begin until the Rhodesian Government declared
unilateral independence from Great Britain in 1965 (2:6).
ZAPU was based mainly in Zambia and Botswana while ZANU was based
in Zambia and in Mozambique (2:8-9). Throughout the war, the
Rhodesian security forces exercised control over the interior of
the country. Tactically, the Rhodesians held their own and there
was never any doubt that Rhodesian security forces could prevail
in any engagement against the insurgent forces (17:5).
Strategically, however, Rhodesia was almost completely isolated,
having become a "pariah" state on the world scene (17:5).
Conversely, ZAPU and ZANU enjoyed wide-spread support from the
Third World and the Communist world as well as tacit, although
reluctant, support from Great Britain and the US. Neither side
could militarily destroy the other. Certainly, the insurgents were
no match for the Rhodesians (2:13). However, the Rhodesians could
not destroy the insurgent infra-structure in Botswana, Mozambique
and Zambia without risking total open warfare with those countries.
16
The result was a stalemate that held only the gloomy prospect of
continued warfare. Unable to continue waging war indefinitely
under conditions of virtual diplomatic and economic isolation, the
Rhodesians "threw in the towel" in 1979 resulting in an
internationally supervised election in 1980. ZANU became the
government of Zimbabwe and the war was over (17:15).
Rhodesian military operations consisted mainly of destroying
insurgent bands operating within Rhodesia and cross-border raids
into neighboring countries to capture prisoners and destroy
insurgent logistical and staging bases (2:12). The cross-border
operations had to be carefully executed to minimize the risks of
open conflict with the countries themselves (17:5).
Grey's Scouts, organized in 1976, were assigned the following
missions:
0 Conduct patrols in order to make contact with
insurgent bands (4:213).
0 Provide a screen in conjunction with crossborder
raids (4:213).
0 Assist engineers in the construction of crossborder
barriers in country unaccessible to
vehicles (2:21).
Patrols would be dispatched from a centralized squadron base camp
for periods of 6 to 7 days. Normally a patrol consisted of 8
soldiers in contact with other patrols and their next higher
echelon of command. Tracker dogs organic to the unit were used in
these patrols. When contact was made, a decision was made as to
whether to insert an airmobile fire-force or whether to engage with
the horse-mounted troops. If an airmobile fire-force was inserted,
the horse-mounted troops took up blocking positions to intercept
fleeing insurgents from the airmobile insertion. If only horsemounted
troops were used, the horse-mounted soldiers would
dismount, fight as infantry while other horse-mounted sections
operating in the area would provide support (4:213).
Frequently, the patrols were directed from helicopters. In one
spectacular engagement, a squadron directed by helicopter, located
a band of 75 insurgents and succeeded in eliminating 60 insurgents
(4:213). Generally, a normal day's patrol would cover about 40
kilometers (2:20).
The purpose of the screen was as much to intercept fleeing
insurgents as it was to provide security for the raid.
Grey's Scouts were largely self-sufficient. Organic to the unit
were farriers, smiths, saddlers and veterinarians. The
17
organization of the unit less service support is shown in Figure
2 (2:20).
The following capabilities and advantages of Grey's Scouts have
been cited:
0 A horse could carry a quarter of its weight
(approximately 330 lbs) and were used to carry
mortars, mines and explosives (4:213).
0 Horses offered speed of reaction (4:213).
0 Horses were quiet (4:212).
0 Horses could extend the range of a ground
patrol (average 40 kilometers/day) (2:20).
0 Horses increase the rider's field of visibility
thus improving the rider's ability to track
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby roy elderkin » Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:44 am

Pat it is good to see that report, which I have not seen for a few years, you tend to forget these things. It is all the more important to me as this is the 36 aniversary of the creation of Grey's. And with friends and former soldiers, now in the twilight of their lives it becomes more important that they are remembered. I would like to thank the forum for retaining some of its history.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Tue Mar 06, 2012 7:35 am

roy elderkin wrote:Pat it is good to see that report, which I have not seen for a few years, you tend to forget these things. It is all the more important to me as this is the 36 aniversary of the creation of Grey's. And with friends and former soldiers, now in the twilight of their lives it becomes more important that they are remembered. I would like to thank the forum for retaining some of its history.



Is there an Anniversary Day for the unit's founding?
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby roy elderkin » Tue Mar 06, 2012 7:49 am

Pat Yes it is today 6th March 1976.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Tue Mar 06, 2012 7:56 am

roy elderkin wrote:Pat Yes it is today 6th March 1976.


I should have realized that from your earlier post! Happy (although no doubt mixed with sadness) Anniversary!
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:02 am

roy elderkin wrote:Pat Yes it is today 6th March 1976.


I've just added the date to our Calendar thread, along with a thanks to the various Grey's who have participated here, and most particularly to you, for all you have shared with us.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby roy elderkin » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:19 am

Pat Thank you behalf of all Grey's wherever they maybe
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Jim Bewley » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:54 am

Pat Holscher wrote:I've just added the date to our Calendar thread, along with a thanks to the various Grey's who have participated here, and most particularly to you, for all you have shared with us.


I will, most heartily, second that. :thumbup:

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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby wkambic » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:55 am

Since the Sun is not yet over yardarm I'll have charge my glass with orange juice and drink to the Greys and their efforts.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Brian P. » Tue Mar 06, 2012 12:00 pm

Here, here!!
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Kelton Oliver » Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:50 pm

To the Grey's!
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Re:

Postby Pat Holscher » Wed Mar 21, 2012 6:47 am

Pat Holscher wrote:
Here's one Roy sent showing the dress uniform.

Image

And here's a color one of Roy in the dress uniform here:

Image
Pat


Roy, was the dress uniform closely based on a preexisting British uniform, or on a uniform with a historical precedent?
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby roy elderkin » Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:45 am

To some extent they do, the two major regt's of the Rhodesian Army were the RAR [Rhodesian African Rifles} and the RLI [Rhodesian Light Infantry] both Regt's were affiliated to the British Light Infantry, Royal Green Jackets hence the badge of the RLI is the infantry bugle, the RAR is the shield, assagai and knobkerry from the Matabele region. The original colours were Green and White , jackets green insignia white. When Zimbabwe came about it was changed to Green and Yellow, as seen on the photo. The bush hat was symbolic, in that only the RAR and former members of the old Federal Army wore them, the rest wore berets. But they do go back historicaly, when the only form of headress was the bush hat, this headdress was adopted by Grey's as a formal no one dress from the original Grey's. The BSAPolice wore them but were known as stable hats, otherwise they wore pithhelmets, until they changed to peaked caps, although the Pith Helmet was issued it was rarely worn, except by the mounted escort.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:45 am

roy elderkin wrote:To some extent they do, the two major regt's of the Rhodesian Army were the RAR [Rhodesian African Rifles} and the RLI [Rhodesian Light Infantry] both Regt's were affiliated to the British Light Infantry, Royal Green Jackets hence the badge of the RLI is the infantry bugle, the RAR is the shield, assagai and knobkerry from the Matabele region. The original colours were Green and White , jackets green insignia white. When Zimbabwe came about it was changed to Green and Yellow, as seen on the photo. The bush hat was symbolic, in that only the RAR and former members of the old Federal Army wore them, the rest wore berets. But they do go back historicaly, when the only form of headress was the bush hat, this headdress was adopted by Grey's as a formal no one dress from the original Grey's. The BSAPolice wore them but were known as stable hats, otherwise they wore pithhelmets, until they changed to peaked caps, although the Pith Helmet was issued it was rarely worn, except by the mounted escort.


Thanks Roy.

I wondered to what extent the dress uniform relied upon British precedent. To the American eye, the uniforms depicted here look very British.

Allow me to ask an ignorant question. What was the "old Federal Army"?

The use of the bush hat is interesting. It has a very widespread history of use, but it tends to have become strongly associated with certain armies or units. This is one such example, and we can see a precedent of similar hats being worn back to the Boer War by at least South African units. Of course, the same type of hat is very strongly associated with the Australians, who limited it to dress and semi dress use post World War Two, but who very recently have allowed it to return to use with their utilities, as they're worried about skin cancer and it still shields the sun as effectively as ever. And of course the Gurkhas use what is basically the same hat. At various points in time, it's use as widespread in the British Army, sometimes unofficially.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby roy elderkin » Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:53 am

Rhodesia did not have a standing Army, it had two services the RAR and C Sqn SAS,during World war 2 the Rhodesians and New Zealanders were mostly used in what was called LRDG [Long range desert group] the forunner of the SAS in North Africa, and some ancilliary units. During the Federal days England was responsible for training, and almost all were British Army Officers. The federal army consisted until its break up in1961 the Federation of Southern Rhodesia, Northern Rhodesia [Zambia] and Nyasaland {Malawi]. The BSAPolice were refered to as the first line of defence, and the army was was always in support of it. At the break of the Federation a new Regt was formed the RLI, Rhodesia now began to have what was regarded as a standing army.
The Fed Army used the bush hat which was Khaki with a sand coloured pugaree with hackle ,closed at the side, RAR's was green with hackle also closed athe side.

The headress goes back to before the Boer War, when it was used as protection from the sun. It was adopted by the British Army after the first Boer War, as well as the khaki coloured pith helmet. I think the Australian's refered to them as slouch hats, in India correct me if is not correct, the Pith helmet was refered to as the Topie. Like all headress it is usualy a matter of adapting or adopting other forms of headress.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:58 pm

roy elderkin wrote:Rhodesia did not have a standing Army, it had two services the RAR and C Sqn SAS,during World war 2 the Rhodesians and New Zealanders were mostly used in what was called LRDG [Long range desert group] the forunner of the SAS in North Africa, and some ancilliary units. During the Federal days England was responsible for training, and almost all were British Army Officers. The federal army consisted until its break up in1961 the Federation of Southern Rhodesia, Northern Rhodesia [Zambia] and Nyasaland {Malawi]. The BSAPolice were refered to as the first line of defence, and the army was was always in support of it. At the break of the Federation a new Regt was formed the RLI, Rhodesia now began to have what was regarded as a standing army.
The Fed Army used the bush hat which was Khaki with a sand coloured pugaree with hackle ,closed at the side, RAR's was green with hackle also closed athe side.

The headress goes back to before the Boer War, when it was used as protection from the sun. It was adopted by the British Army after the first Boer War, as well as the khaki coloured pith helmet. I think the Australian's refered to them as slouch hats, in India correct me if is not correct, the Pith helmet was refered to as the Topie. Like all headress it is usualy a matter of adapting or adopting other forms of headress.


I have a message pertaining to the brimmed hats in this thread that pertains to both this topic and the old slouch hat thread, so I'm going to post a quote from here, depicting your dress uniform, in the slouch hat thread, so that can be explored there. Interesting item.
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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby roy elderkin » Sun May 06, 2012 6:24 am

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Re: Rhodesian McClellans and the Greys Scouts

Postby Pat Holscher » Wed May 09, 2012 9:09 pm

roy elderkin wrote:Image


Roy, looks to be a happy occasion in the bush. What's the story on this one?
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