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Re: WWII Participants

Postby Kelton Oliver » Sun May 06, 2012 1:50 am

Pat Holscher wrote:Finally, post war, Spain not only became a conduit out for fleeing Germans, but it also picked up some German industry. Hecklar & Koch got its start in post war Spain, for example.


The G3 rifle which was the flagship of the H&K line for three decades, was such a straight copy of the Spanish CETME that many of the parts will interchange. The entire trigger, pistol grip, and fire control group, for example. Even the bolt and carrier in some cases.
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Re: WWII Participants

Postby wkambic » Sun May 06, 2012 8:23 am

A quick Google search is not exactly deep scholarship, but should do for my purposes. :)

After WWI many new nations appeared in Central Europe as the German and Austro-Hungarian empires were dissolved. Some also appeared as break-aways from the Russian Empire. These countries were, in the main, extremely nationalistic, tended to be militaristic and despotic, and were virulently anti-Communist (and often virulently anti-Semitic). Ironically, Czechoslovakia was the one country that was almost none of these things.

Their internal politics was difficult before the Great Depression, but hopeless afterwards. The rise of the Nazis in Germany influenced many of these nations to fashion political parties on the Nazi model. In Hungary you had the Cross Arrow Party and in Romania something called the National Socialist Romania Party. Romania also had a large number of other right-wing parties, most prominent of which was the Iron Guard.

While there was no great love for Germany, there was a desire to emulate the economic success of the Nazis in pulling Germany out of the Great Depression. There was also a desire to ensure that they did not fall victim to the ambitions of Soviet leader Stalin.

When the War began German successes were amazing, from their point of view. While Britain was probably far better off in the fall of 1940 than either Goebbels or Joe Kennedy said they were the hard truth was that they had been defeated in detail in France. That the British had won the Battle of Britain did not mean they were in the clear (any more than the U.S. victory at Midway ended the Japanese threat). From the perspective of anti-Communist leaders in Central Europe it would have been clear that the Germans were the coming power. It was only a matter of time.

German success in Russia in the fall of 1941 would have further convinced the Central European states that Germany was their best hope. The Werhmacht had easily defeated the Red Army, inflicting catastrophic casualties. This would have been further motivation to engage in active military operations in hope of not only permanently removing the Russian threat, but maybe even obtaining additional territory.

So they cast their lot with the Axis. With the aid of 20/20 hindsight this was a dramatically bad decision. But from the perspective of the time it made good sense.
Bill Kambic

Mangalarga Marchador: Uma raça, uma paixão
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Re: WWII Participants

Postby Pat Holscher » Mon May 07, 2012 7:08 am

In the category of things you think of when you haven't had enough coffee, I was listening to NPR's podcast on Its All Politics, which concluded, oddly enough, with a reference to the Spanish Civil War.

The show then wrapped up with the old Saturday Night LIve bit in which the bogus news broadcast breaks in with the news that Francisco Franco was still dead. I'd forgotten that bit, but in the context of the times (lots of news updates that Franco was ill and dying, but not dead yet), it was funny. I'm surprised I can remember that.

And then, the concluding song was Folk Song Army:

One type of song that has come into increasing prominence in recent months is the folk-song of protest. You have to admire people who sing these songs. It takes a certain amount of courage to get up in a coffee-house or a college auditorium and come out in favor of the things that everybody else in the audience is against like peace and justice and brotherhood and so on. The nicest thing about a protest song is that it makes you feel so good. I have a song here which I realise should be accompanied on a folk instrument in which category the piano does not alas qualify so imagine if you will that I am playing an 88 string guitar.

We are the Folk Song Army.
Everyone of us cares.
We all hate poverty, war, and injustice,
Unlike the rest of you squares.

There are innocuous folk songs.
Yeah, but we regard 'em with scorn.
The folks who sing 'em have no social conscience.
Why they don't even care if Jimmy Crack Corn.

If you feel dissatisfaction,
Strum your frustrations away.
Some people may prefer action,
But give me a folk song any old day.

The tune don't have to be clever,
And it don't matter if you put a coupla extra syllables into a line.
It sounds more ethnic if it ain't good English,
And it don't even gotta rhyme--excuse me--rhyne.

Remember the war against Franco?
That's the kind where each of us belongs.
Though he may have won all the battles,
We had all the good songs.

So join in the Folk Song Army,
Guitars are the weapons we bring
To the fight against poverty, war, and injustice.
Ready! Aim! Sing!
Pat

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